RomanceClass.com Forums Romance Dating Gay marriage

Gay marriages are being legalised in various countries, but with different responses, and I think it might be worth us discussing the matter, here.

However, this subject is bound to cause some peoples' emotions to run high, so, if you would like to comment on it, please try to keep your posts logical, and ensure that they are not offensive.

Thank you.

A BBC site recived these comments, among others:

"Marriage and religion are not the same thing. Marriage is a legal contract. Saying "I do" in church does not make a marriage binding - you have to sign a register. The church hijacked marriage hundreds of years ago. People marry in church to have a religious service to satisfy their beliefs. Others do it in a registry office. As for what is "right" and "wrong" according to the bible - it also says divorce is wrong, adultery, eating certain foods at certain times (Lent is a prime example), that you should sacrifice livestock when your wife gets pregnant.... exactly how many people here who are bible-bashing can hold their hands up and say they follow these doctrines? Until you can, you should follow another passage from the bible - something about "let he who is without sin cast the first stone"? All I see here are hypocrites." Anon. UK.

"As a marriage is a union of a male and a female person in the sight of God, it is ridiculous to say that a group of lawmakers can 'legalise' or 'ban' what is not theirs to decide. Politicians should focus on clarifying what rights and responsibilities co-habiting couples of any persuasion should be entitled to from the State rather than abusing a religious concept for secular legal and political reasons."
Geoff, Portsmouth, UK

(http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/talking_point/3895983.stm)

I have found a number of other relevant items, which I will post separately.

Gay marriage in the news: Gay Marriage: The Arguments and the Motives A personal essay by Scott Bidstrup [The entire article is worth reading] Ask just about anyone. They'll all tell you they're in favor of equal rights for homosexuals. Just name the situation, and ask. They'll all say, yes, gays should have the same rights in housing, jobs, public accommodations, and should have equal access to government benefits, equal protection of the law, etcetera, etcetera. Then you get to gay marriage. And that's when all this talk of equality stops dead cold. More than half of all people in the United States oppose gay marriage, even though three fourths are otherwise supportive of gay rights. http://www.bidstrup.com/marriage.htm * * * BBC News : Monday, 19 July, 2004, 20:08 GMT 21:08 UK Should same-sex marriages be made legal? President George W Bush has said he will carry on trying to make homosexual marriages illegal in the US after a constitutional amendment on the issue was defeated by the Senate. The Republican proposal failed to gain the support of the 60 senators it needed to progress to the next stage. Mr Bush is seeking to change the US constitution to specify that marriage can only take place between a man and a woman. So far 38 US states have banned homosexual marriage, but lawsuits in Florida, Nebraska, New Jersey and Oregon are seeking to have it ruled legal. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/talking_point/3895983.stm This item is followed by a series of comments by the public. * * * The Week 4/2/2004 The origins of marriage Men who married men [b]Gay marriage is rare in history—but not unknown[/b]. The Roman emperor Nero, who ruled from A.D. 54 to 68, twice married men in formal wedding ceremonies, and forced the Imperial Court to treat them as his wives. In second- and third-century Rome, homosexual weddings became common enough that it worried the social commentator Juvenal …. “Look—a man of family and fortune—being wed to a man!” Juvenal wrote. “Such things, before we’re very much older, will be done in public.” He mocked such unions, saying that male “brides” would never be able to “hold their husbands by having a baby.” The Romans outlawed formal homosexual unions in the year 342. But Yale history professor John Boswell says he’s found scattered evidence of homosexual unions after that time, including some that were recognized by Catholic and Greek Orthodox churches. [b]In one 13th-century Greek Orthodox ceremony, the “Order for Solemnisation of Same Sex Union,”[/b] the celebrant asked God to grant the participants “grace to love one another and to abide unhated and not a cause of scandal all the days of their lives, with the help of the Holy Mother of God and all thy saints.” http://www.theweekmagazine.com/briefing.asp?a_id=567 * * * http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/southern_counties/4575173.stm Priest set to wed in gay marriage A [b]gay clergywoman will take part in the UK's first same-sex wedding in Brighton later this year[/b]. The Rev Debbie Gaston.. will marry her partner of 16 years .. on 21 December - the first day gay weddings are legal. Two other couples will marry on the same morning in a joint ceremony at the register office in Brighton Town Hall. The city's council has been a supporter of gay weddings, which become possible under the new Civil Partnership Act. The Act comes into force on 5 December, but there is a 15-day period before any ceremonies can take place, making 21 December the first day couples can tie the knot. * * * April 22, 2005 Vatican attack on Spain's gay marriage law BY RUTH GLEDHILL, RELIGION CORRESPODENT A senior Vatican cardinal has today condemned as "iniquitous" plans to allow gay marriages and adoptions in Spain, one of Europe's most Catholic countries. The attack on the Spanish Government's Bill to legalise same-sex marriages is an early indication of how the new papacy can be expected to adhere rigidly to the precedents put in place by Pope John Paul II, and supported by Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger in his role as Prefect for the Congregation of the Doctrine of the Faith. The new Pope has described homosexuality as objectively disordered and an intrinsic moral evil. The Bill was adopted on Thursday .. making Spain the third country to recognise gay marriages and the first in Europe to allow gay marriages and adoption of children by gay couples. http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,20709-1580888,00.html * * * Cambodian king backs gay marriage Cambodia's King Norodom Sihanouk has shown that advancing years are no barrier to an open mind and liberal attitude. After watching television images of gay marriages in San Francisco, the 81-year-old monarch has decided that single sex weddings should be allowed in Cambodia too. [b]He said he had respect for homosexual and lesbians and said they were as they were because God loved a "wide range of tastes."[/b] http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/3505915.stm * * The Sunday Times - Britain May 29, 2005 Church to let gay clergy ‘marry’ but they must stay celibate CHRISTOPHER MORGAN HOMOSEXUAL priests in the Church of England will be allowed to “marry” their boyfriends under a proposal drawn up by senior bishops, led by Rowan Williams, the Archbishop of Canterbury. The decision ensures that gay and lesbian clergy who wish to register relationships under the new “civil partnerships” law — giving them many of the tax and inheritance advantages of married couples — will not lose their licences to be priests. They will, however, have to give an assurance to their diocesan bishop that they will abstain from sex. … http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2087-1632517,00.html * * * Canada 'can permit gay marriage' The majority of Canadians are in favour of same-sex marriage Canada's Supreme Court has told the government it can legalise gay marriage without violating the constitution. The move comes hours after New Zealand's parliament voted to recognise civil unions between gay couples. Prime Minister Paul Martin said his Liberal government would bring in gay marriage legislation in the new year. Thursday, 9 December, 2004, 19:10 GMT http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4082819.stm * * * The case for gay marriage Feb 26th 2004 From The Economist print edition It rests on equality, liberty and even society SO AT last it is official: George Bush is in favour of unequal rights, … That is the implication of his announcement this week that he will support efforts to pass a constitutional amendment in America banning gay marriage. … Mr Bush says that he is acting to protect “the most fundamental institution of civilisation” from what he sees as “activist judges” who in Massachusetts early this month confirmed an earlier ruling that banning gay marriage is contrary to their state constitution. The city of San Francisco, gay capital of America, has been issuing thousands of marriage licences to homosexual couples, in apparent contradiction to state and even federal laws. http://www.economist.com/printedition/displaystory.cfm?story_id=2459758 * * See also: http://www.debatabase.org/details.asp?topicID=63

I can't see anything wrong in gays getting married. It obviously offends many but in a few years it'll be different I'm sure.

Living together thirty years ago between heterosexuals was considered an outrage. I mean, how dare you live with someone without marriage, it's sinful.

Having a baby out of wedlock was frowned upon. Many babies HAD to be put up for adoption because of this.

Priests marry? Why not?

If gays want to marry, let them.

(I haven't put a lot of thought into this as my mum's just returned from hospital so not thinking as well as I should)

Another thing is that things always change as the years go by so undoubtedly this will all be something that will become quite legal in the future.

Alright I thought I would just mention this.. deacons can marry and they can do everything that a priest can except for concecrating the eucharist and a few other minor things.

That's interesting, Ashley. It makes you wonder, even more, why priests can't marry.

It seems that the time is likely to be now.

From the BBC News website, Wednesday, 29 June, 2005:

'Canada's parliament has approved a bill to legalise same-sex marriage, despite opposition from conservative MPs.
The bill was supported by 158 lawmakers in the 308-seat House of Commons, with 133 MPs voting against.

'It is expected to win Senate approval and become law by July, making Canada the third country after the Netherlands and Belgium to allow gay marriages.

'Gay marriage is already legal in eight of 10 provinces and one of Canada's three territories.'

Full item: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4632229.stm

I read that today PDM and I'm all in favour of it.

I'm not gay but I can't understand why two people in love can't be married.

I have two cousin's who are gay, one female and one male and two more loving and caring people would be hard to find. My cousin Krissy is going to Canada later this year to marry the girl she has as a partner. They've been together now ten years and are still very much in love.

Down here (New Zealand) earlier this year the parliment passed what is called the "Civil Union Bill" Which is basically saying that same sex relationships are ok. Although not a "marriage" the relationship is "recognised officially". This accompanies an earlier amendment to property laws giving same sex defacto couples equal proprty rights ("matrimonial property act")should a relationship dissolve after two years. Previously it had related to a three year period, and only to male/female relationships. So, with the two pieces of legislation combined, i would say that it could be quite strongly argued that New Zealand was the third country to legalise same sex "marriages".
There was so much uproar during the reading of the bill that people from opposing parties very came to blows in public protests.....
Personally, i dont have an opinion on the matter as it has no bearing on my life - good luck to all.